Is it worth the time and money to learn this product? thanks to all.
i don't like the stuff. i took a long look at it at woc in 2004 and then again at 2007 woc this year. they had lots of samples of it at their booth, and it just isn't impressive.
you are much better off with a plain micro topping system like elitecrete's that goes over a stronger overlay and can be stained. it's a better look and it's got to hold up stronger as well.
skimstone is popular with the faux painting crowd, and i think that's where it ends. it might look okay on walls, but it's not for the serious decorative concrete flooring contractor.
I have used this on several jobs. It is so thin and the sealer does not look like much. I have to say I doubted how it would hold up. I have done an art gallery and a childrens playroom at a church. They have been down two and three years. They look like the day I did them. I have not been by the other jobs but these two look great.
This is a pic of the art gallery.
Demus DCR, Inc.
Beautiful floor, Demus.
thtas just awesome! I want to start offering stuff like that man.....
that just looks like a typical acid-stain micro topping. not skimstone's multiple layers of integrally colored stuff. you can get the exact same look with elitecrete or any other company's micro topping. i would start looking into compressive and tensile strengths before i bought into their system as opposed to somebody's else's, as well as their tech and product support.
a microtopping with that much texture to it? I attended an elitecrete seminar and they didnt look like that.
[quote name="mississippi" time="2007-10-01 11:06:35"]a microtopping with that much texture to it? I attended an elitecrete seminar and they didnt look like that.[/quote]
I agree 100%. The Elitecrete stuff looks awful!
skimstone is a micro topping with little or no aggregate. it has no "texture". what you refer to as texture is actually the marbling effect of the stain, and that can be achieved with any company's micro topping. the good thing about elitecrete's micro topping is that it is preceded by a coarser overlay that has some compressive strength to it. skimstone is not. they just add layer after layer of the aggregate-free micro topping. elitecrete makes one of the best overlay systems in the industry and if you don't like what you're seeing, it's because of applicator error or inexperience.
Here's the acutual process I used. I diamond ground off the cure-N-seal. Vaccummed floor clean.
First layer of skim stone was 6 oz of tan liguid pigment add to the 4 quarts of powder to 4 quartzs of modifier. Trowel on as tightly as possible. Let dry.
Second layer 4 oz of tan to same ratio of mix. Trowel tighly.
Third layer is 2 oz tan to same ratio of mix. Trowel as tight as possbile. This is as smooth as power troweld concrete.
Apply two coats sealer with micro fiber pad. There sealer does not look like much but is very effective.
The color is not from staining but from the alternating color changes in each layer.
I have no idea of the compresion strength but the walls you see in the photos are movable with the change of artist displays. The change artist once a month. So far I have not seen any damage in two years.
Demus whats the cost to apply per SF? thanks for all your info
Ipersonally think this skimstone floor on this thread is the prettiest stuff Ive ever seen!
sentence came out weird.....LOL
Seems like Skimstone is the #1 product used by the Faux Painting people. Skimstone was very smart marketing to Faux Painters not just concrete people. I see more and more Faux painters doing decorative concrete. I would suggest learning this product or something similar.
at either the basic or advanc'd eC seminars, you wouldn't have seen this type of work but its easily attainable despite inez having a ****on for eC, miss.
best [the original] yic-yac
EDIT NUMERO UNO - please delete ' a ****on ' & insert ' panties in a wad ',,, apologies for the mis-genderfication ( sp ? ),,, have a nice weekend ;-)
[quote name="suntacsys" time="2007-10-02 11:20:27"]at either the basic or advanc'd eC seminars, you wouldn't have seen this type of work but its easily attainable despite inez having a ****on for eC, miss.
best [the original] yic-yac[/quote]
I don't have the necessary equipment to have a **** for ec. But I do have eyes and have seen quite a bit of thier product down. If you want a fake look then I suppose it's as good as any of the other fakecrete lines. But I have an open mind in regard to thier line. Perhaps you'd like to show us your work with it?
Demus the floor looks great. But it almost looks to me that there is texture like from a stamped overlay. You got that look from troweling multiple layers on very smooth?
Whenever I do this type of process the floor has more subtle shaded type of variations.
Never the less it looks awesome
Mississippi, I can not remember the cost per sq. ft. I have not done one in a while or ordered product since last year.
The texture is very smooth. It can be a little trick to put down. I would like to go to one of their classes to learn more.
This is a picture of a spray texture material I trowel on with texture. This is one coat, sanded with a buffer and 36 grit sand paper pad, Stained and sealed.
excellent work..... What I was thinking... wouldnt it be the same to put down a textured stamped overlay? did u stamp the stuff in the pics at all or just troweled?
one coat of what exactly did you spary down?if u dont mind me asking
I must admit, those jobs look great, but you can achieve that same look by using materials that you can buy locally at your local concrete supply place.
Keep in mind that Skimstone doesn't manufacture these products, they only private label them.
As long as you know the chemical composition of the bonding agents, size of silica sand used in their bag mixes,cement to sand ratio, and pigment type used, you can buy all of these materials for PENNIES a square foot locally and save a bundle.
I wish I knew the chemical composition
Here goes the composition. For the bonding agent, use 100% acrylic polymer (25% solids), NOT P.V.A (NO COPOLYMERS) just straight up styrenated polymer.
For the bag mix, use 125 sieve silica with portland type 2, at a ratio of 1 1/2 parts of silica sand to 1 part portland type 2.
For the colorants use Ethylene based universal colorants, such as the ones used by your local paint store to color latex paints.
The 125 sieve is good up to 1/4" thick. if doing an 3/4" overlay, switch to an 80 sieve, and switch your bonding agent to an P.V.A at a ratio of 3 to 1 with water.
We have been custom mixing our bag mixes for many years, with great results, and have saved a bundle while doing it.
Leo N. (shadetree chemist)
wow..... excellent, this mix good for stamped overlays then and what else?
my bad I didnt read the last part......
[quote name="mississippi" time="2007-10-02 19:01:26"]wow..... excellent, this mix good for stamped overlays then and what else?[/quote]
If it's too good to be true...
I don''t want to discourage you from mixing your own but I do want to caution you from thinking that formula is complete. I could send you a hundred just like it I got from various polymer mfg companies (starter formulas), friends in the industry etc., and guess what, they're all pretty worthless. The sand someone uses in california is probably different that sands in Mississippi. And the sands you'll get in Mississippi will vary from load to load, as does the cement you'll get. Additionally thier are a few necessary ingredients omitted as well as some that while not absolutely necessary, definitely very beneficial. Beware, and best wishes!
Leo's system works well for him. As for me I chose to use a companies bag mix instead. I personally do not have time to gather all the components and blend them togeather. I like the fact I can open a bag, mix with water add color if neccessary and go.
I have a engineer friend in Richmond and loves to mix his own counter top mix. He has some cool stuff. Me I would rather take someone elses mix and see how cool I can make it look. I wish I had more time to experiment with all the products I would like to play with. If anyone has any cool ideas lets talk and post some pics and see what we come up with. I know Leo has some cool work. Let's push some new ideas around.
Demus DCR, Inc.
Want more, I have hundreds. With love, wanker.
Makes me feel like an amature. Great work!
Demus, You do nice work. Most all of the product lines can produce good results. It's the applicator that messes them up. Not sure why inez has her panties in a knot on Elite Crete.... don't care.
Product ease, support.... and of course longevity are the key ingredients for a good overlay. Elite Crete meets those requirements. I can produce some really outstanding floors with their product. I teach this stuff now which is a complete new world for me.
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